My gatherings were going on as normal, but I didn’t have a scholar that could teach us. But all activities were running as normal. Attila comes to the gathering, and we all know Attila likes to speak and he speaks with emotion. But one thing people must understand is that it’s my house, and I must prevent anyone from preaching hatred or killing. Now, you don’t have the probes from before September ’05, where I have discussions with Attila, many times, even at Finsbury Park Mosque, where I have advised him not to talk to the media and never to talk of hatred or killing. This I used to drill this into his head. I used to say Abu Hamza and Sheikh Faisal got locked up for saying such words and preaching hatred. I told him to keep away from this.
Now Attila came back to my house and he is telling me that I am right in what I’m saying and he is saying he agrees in the way I follow Islam. This is why I chose him to be amir. Half of the guys in my gatherings from south London were very close to Attila, so I thought he would be able to control them better than me. We did have a vote and everybody agreed he would be amir. But why did we choose an amir?
When we used to gather every week we were doing the same thing and someone suggested that we should get a scholar to teach us. Someone said we should get a hall. Then someone said we should have an inner circle [shura]. Then we decided, and we made Attila as the amir to bring stability and discipline; not a preacher or a scholar because I said we will bring Hanafi scholars to teach us.
Now this is why we had a shura of 6 people and Attila as the amir. We 7 of us decided how these gatherings would run and what activities we would do. All organising was done collectively. I did not organise like how they claim, “Hamid organised the camping and the paintballing and the physical exercise. Hamid was in charge of this and that.” This is totally untrue. Probe after probe proves that I was not in charge and the camping was organised collectively. The last two paintballings I did not organise and this was done by others, but I did help out. All of us collectively organised and it would be unjust to point me out as one.
Attila used to speak a lot, and I did not think he was speaking in the manner of Abu Hamza or Faisal. If he did, I would stop him and we would have an understanding. I daydream a lot and at times we were talking over each other and other times I was in the kitchen, so I didn’t hear everything what has been said in my house. But what I did hear, I had corrected him, then and there, and other times I’ve done it privately to stop any arguments and in an Islamic manner, we must correct someone privately.
But what I did hear at my house, I never imagined this came under soliciting murder. I can imagine what other radical scholars have said but what Attila has said: this I can’t believe it to be a crime in the privacy of my house. IF I knew this was a crime then I would have put a stop to it.
Plus when I spoke, I never knew the Islamic words that I used were illegal. We used these words a lot:
“Allah loves those who fight for His cause,
Allah loves those who shed their blood for His cause,
Allah loves those who give their life for his cause.”
These 3 sentences are the same in meaning and it can mean so many different things. Allah loves those who implement sharia “Law & Order”: [but]
Tony Blair loves those who implement Law & Order.
Tony Blair loves those who fight and shed their blood to implement Law & Order in Iraq and Afghanistan.
In the Quran Allah says He loves those who fight and give their life to implement Law & Order. We can spread Law& Order of God with our tongue. Anyway, this is Quran and Hadith- I never knew it was a crime. If I knew this, then I would never have used these words- please, we Muslims don’t know what is legal or illegal.
I never spoke of killings or hatred, but I spoke of forgiveness and love and saving the peoples souls from the hellfire. I never spoke like Hamza or Faisal or any radical clerics. I was not even speaking like Attila. In the probes I always spoke of good and spiritual Islam but none of this is shown and the 100% of the notes that you have are from 5% and they only chose the bad parts. But they are clever in making us look like we are these radical and hateful group by just showing you 1% out of one year long probe.
Everybody’s got bad mood swings, I might be in a bad mood, something I see on the news, maybe something happens to me at the Dawah Table and I was angry or I’m shown a picture of children dying in Iraq. Then you will hear me speak with a different mood swing; you can not judge just on people’s mood swings. What about when they’re in a good mood? I spoke good most of the time, but they never showed this side of me.
I never solicited to murder or talked of hatred, I never told anyone to kill or go and fight abroad, I never told anyone to cause any act of terrorism nor did I ever agree with the 7/7 or the 21/7 nor did I ever agree with 9/11. I always said this act was not done by Muslims and this is done to make the Muslims look bad. I never glorified any of these acts and I did not tell anyone to do this type of act. I totally disagree on suicide.